December 08, 2016, 12:08:13 AM
News: If it is not in arbusers, it doesn't exist.

Blacktype

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Skaggerak
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« on: August 25, 2016, 06:52:16 PM »

New Sportsbook, know very little about them but look intriguing.
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dealer wins
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« Reply #1 on: August 25, 2016, 07:07:46 PM »

New Sportsbook, know very little about them but look intriguing.

They say no sign up bonus, boosts, BOG etc, but they will take decent size bets and not limit winners.

I will judge them but the amount of arbs they create.  If its next to none, then im interested, if they are constantly featured on alert services, they are doomed to failure taking peoples balances with them.
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MaxShalamar
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« Reply #2 on: August 25, 2016, 07:33:04 PM »

LOL - just came here to post the same - hoping its a decent book and the arb services pick it up quickly

https://www.blacktype.bet/why-black-type/

Quote
Do you do a welcome offer?

We know that current UK punters would prefer to get a bet, and continue to get a bet rather than be given a welcome offer and then closed within a few bets. Therefore we will not be offering any welcome bonuses or free bets to new customers. That's not to say we won't reward loyal punters with free bets from time to time.

Let's hope they stick to their word - being UK based makes a big difference to their honesty IMO but we'll see
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 07:35:59 PM by MaxShalamar » Logged

luctens
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« Reply #3 on: August 25, 2016, 07:42:09 PM »

New Sportsbook, know very little about them but look intriguing.


They say no sign up bonus, boosts, BOG etc, but they will take decent size bets and not limit winners.

I will judge them but the amount of arbs they create.  If its next to none, then im interested, if they are constantly featured on alert services, they are doomed to failure taking peoples balances with them.

You're saying that if they don't have hardly any arbs then you're interested, but if they have loads of arbs then you're not interested. Surely if they've got hardly any arbs then they're of very little use to you anyway?

There's a report on http://www.sbcnews.co.uk/europe/uk/2016/08/25/racing-specialist-black-type-launches-on-fsb-technology/. They seem reputable looking at that report.

It's absolutely ludicrous to say that by having odds that create many arbs and laying customers to lose £500-£1000 on those odds means they are "doomed to failure". For sure it wouldn't be easy, but as long as they manage their book well then this is a manageable level of exposure to have so there's no point in making kneejerk reactions before they've even started. From the SBC News report it sounds as if the people behind Black Type are reputable, have significant experience in this sector and believe that this business model will work, and if quite senior figures in the industry which they sound like they are, if they believe this will work, then I certainly believe it has a good chance of succeeding.

They are UKGC licenced under https://secure.gamblingcommission.gov.uk/gccustomweb/PublicRegister/PRAccountDetails.aspx?accountNo=22201.

From my initial look at their site, it seems that Black Type are handling the horse racing odds with all other sports being the standard issue crap odds from FSB Technology and handled by FSB.

Their odds are on the Oddschecker grids. The horse racing seems to have a few small arbs from time to time but the odds get cut very quickly when they appear and the very small return on those sorts of arbs aren't really worth spending your time looking for.

With the other sports, I don't think I've seen any FSB Technology book on an alert service before but from what I've seen in the past with FSB Technology odds, they are very middle of the road not being on the sharp or soft side of the odds hardly any of the time so you will probably find it very hard to find any arbs.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 07:54:32 PM by luctens » Logged

MaxShalamar
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« Reply #4 on: August 25, 2016, 07:52:17 PM »

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With the other sports, I don't think I've seen any FSB Technology book on an alert service before but from what I've seen in the past with FSB Technology odds, they are very middle of the road not being on the sharp or soft side of the odds hardly any of the time so you will probably find it very hard to find any arbs.

TBH even if their arbs are only 0.5-1% they will be worth using with decent limits - any higher arbs and the muppets will steam in and ruin it for everyone

I get what dealer wins means about few arbs being better - the less arbs they produce the less arbers will use them and leave the cream for the rest of us with bigger bankrolls - also no bonus is good because the greedy newbs will stay away too

Also another point is that they say they like winners but it will be interesting to  know what their attitude to arbers is? - arbers are a lot smarter than winning punters
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 07:54:45 PM by MaxShalamar » Logged

luctens
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« Reply #5 on: August 25, 2016, 08:20:36 PM »

Quote
With the other sports, I don't think I've seen any FSB Technology book on an alert service before but from what I've seen in the past with FSB Technology odds, they are very middle of the road not being on the sharp or soft side of the odds hardly any of the time so you will probably find it very hard to find any arbs.

TBH even if their arbs are only 0.5-1% they will be worth using with decent limits - any higher arbs and the muppets will steam in and ruin it for everyone

I get what dealer wins means about few arbs being better - the less arbs they produce the less arbers will use them and leave the cream for the rest of us with bigger bankrolls - also no bonus is good because the greedy newbs will stay away too

Also another point is that they say they like winners but it will be interesting to  know what their attitude to arbers is? - arbers are a lot smarter than winning punters
I've manually looked at FSB Technology odds a number of times in the past and I can't remember hardly ever finding one arb at all, not even 0.50%-1.00% so whilst I agree that even if there were arbs at this level then they would be useful, I can't remember ever finding any even at that low level before. As I said previously, the horse racing odds may have some arbs but their odds change so quickly, they generally only come up very close to the race where exchange odds are flip flopping about all over the place so I don't think that would really be worth it with the amount of times the exchange prices would go against you so close to the off as opposed to the length of time you would need to manually look through all of the races over and over and opposed to the very small return you would get even if you are lucky enough for the price to hold on the exchange.

On their sports odds, I think the reason is that FSB Technology are handling these odds on behalf of 5 or 6 different sportsbooks so they probably feel a responsibility to change the odds super quick when they may be a possibility of an arb, whereas if it was just a bookmaker working for themselves, then they could probably take more opinions and leave prices for longer but as FSB are handling the odds and everything for 5 or 6 other providers and those providers are relying on them to get it right, they have to be properly on the ball with changing prices quickly.

By all means have a look yourself manually to see if you can find anything, but I think we would be needing alert services to dig out any arbs at all that there may be lying about in these odds.

If what you are saying about what dealer wins was saying is correct, then I sort of see what he means but he was saying about there being "next to none" arbs, but obviously to make any profit then there have to be at some least some arbs available to be able to make any money out of them in the first place.

The only thing I've found them saying about arbing is on https://www.blacktype.bet/faq/. It says:

"How long do you hold your prices for?'

All our prices are subject to fluctuation once they are live on the site. We try to hold prices for as long as we can but if they are in demand we have to move in order to balance our books. We will try to be very fair and the one type of customer not welcome at Black Type is those using 'queue jumping' robotic bet placement/arbitrage tools. We think using robotic software to place bets is wholly unfair and accounts we believe to be using such software to place bets may well be heavily restricted."

They seem to only not like robotic tools to be used to actually place the bets so it seems that as long as you manually place the bets then they have no problem with that. They do mention "arbitrage tools" there which maybe suggests that they don't like customers looking at their odds through arb alert services so maybe they will block any arb alert services from getting odds from their site but even if that's the case, that is easily got around by arb alert services by getting the odds from one of the other FSB books that have the same odds that allow odds scraping and to use those to get the odds for Black Type. If an arb alert service can get the odds for Black Type or one of the FSB clones and you find something on that arb alert service but you place the bet manually, then I can't see how they can restrict you based on using arbitrage tools because all they will have been able to see is that you placed the bet manually.

In general, if a sportsbook says they won't close winners down, then they pretty much have to be prepared to take arbers as well, because value bettors/winning punters/arbers are likely to be betting on the same sort of things anyway as whatever method you are using to be able to win long term, all of it is concerned with getting value and there is no way they can specifically tell whether you are just a good punter that is winning, if you are a value bettor or if you are an arber, so if they try stunts by saying that winning punters are arbers and therefore banning them when they have absolutely no evidence except from their opinion that these customers are arbing, then that flies in the face of what they are trying to sell themselves as. If they say they take winners, they should take winners regardless of the customer's motivation for making the bet, it's as simple as that.
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 08:27:48 PM by luctens » Logged

MaxShalamar
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« Reply #6 on: August 25, 2016, 08:35:11 PM »

We'll have to wait and see I suppose - fair play to those who manually find arbs but I don't really have the time and need an arb service so we'll see if they pick up any - betbrain are usually the first to add new bookies so we should have a decent indication when they do

They will either be very useful or useless - UK based will be a huge advantage and even if they do limit it will be interesting to see what the limits are because some limited accounts are still very viable - only the number of arbs is the issue here IMO

A couple a day and I'd be very happy
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« Reply #7 on: August 25, 2016, 08:43:10 PM »

They could even be useful to get out of a worsening situation, or lock in a profit, especially when Pinbet88 have their daily maintenance at the wrong time lol
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MaxShalamar
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« Reply #8 on: August 25, 2016, 09:30:46 PM »

http://www.sbcnews.co.uk/europe/uk/2016/08/25/racing-specialist-black-type-launches-on-fsb-technology/


BTW - anyone have a list of bookies that use FSB?

EDIT: - never mind :D

http://www.fsbtech.com/

The only one I know is Dafa so when I get time I'll check a few odd to see if there is any similarity between Dafa and Black Type

Another EDIT: - checked 10 Premier and 10 Championship games and half a dozen tennis matches - exactly the same odds as Dafabet so for non racing we can probably treat them as a clone for arb services :)
« Last Edit: August 25, 2016, 09:41:26 PM by MaxShalamar » Logged

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« Reply #9 on: August 25, 2016, 10:34:06 PM »

Max you are on the ball mate!
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MaxShalamar
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« Reply #10 on: August 25, 2016, 10:53:16 PM »

Max you are on the ball mate!

Just a sad git who had nothing better to do :D
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luctens
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« Reply #11 on: August 25, 2016, 11:05:26 PM »

http://www.sbcnews.co.uk/europe/uk/2016/08/25/racing-specialist-black-type-launches-on-fsb-technology/

Another EDIT: - checked 10 Premier and 10 Championship games and half a dozen tennis matches - exactly the same odds as Dafabet so for non racing we can probably treat them as a clone for arb services :)

I was already aware Dafabet was one of the clones but I thought Dafabet's Asian style book was the only one that is on any arb alert services.

Dafabet's European style book isn't on any of the arb alert services is it?
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MaxShalamar
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« Reply #12 on: August 25, 2016, 11:10:29 PM »

http://www.sbcnews.co.uk/europe/uk/2016/08/25/racing-specialist-black-type-launches-on-fsb-technology/

Another EDIT: - checked 10 Premier and 10 Championship games and half a dozen tennis matches - exactly the same odds as Dafabet so for non racing we can probably treat them as a clone for arb services :)

I was already aware Dafabet was one of the clones but I thought Dafabet's Asian style book was the only one that is on any arb alert services.

Dafabet's European style book isn't on any of the arb alert services is it?


Not sure - Betburger rarely gives an arb for Dafa so can't check at the moment
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« Reply #13 on: August 26, 2016, 06:29:08 AM »

Seems like they have updated their FAQ:

"Will you close my account if I back Arbs?

We do not welcome customers who use 'queue jumping' robotic bet placement/arbitrage tools. Using computer software to PLACE bets and gain an advantage is something we consider to be wholly unfair and accounts believed to be using such software may well be heavily restricted. Those using software to FIND arb bets however are welcome but, be quick, the prices won't last long as others are after that price too!"

Basically: Arbers are welcome, but they seem to think that we can't do them much harm without bots/software  ::)
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« Reply #14 on: August 26, 2016, 08:48:33 AM »


I reckon they will be out of business by the end of next year. Bookmakers who welcome arbers don't survive unless they are dead smart like Pinnacle and Sbobet.
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