BET-IBC SCAM EXPOSED - With proofs (page 2)

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Alfa1234
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Alfa1234

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #15 on: December 23, 2018, 02:35:52 PM »

@Bet-IBC, do you have any idea if betfair voided both transactions? I mean, betfair voided your customer that won 64k, yet someone else lost those 64k. What happened to the other guy that lost? Was he refunded?

In which case, if they are telling the truth, Tennistrader would not have "lost" any money so it's unlikely he would be complaining here if that was the case.  Unless someone did confiscate a balance somewhere...
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apoel81
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Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #16 on: December 23, 2018, 04:42:06 PM »

@Alfa1234, If betfair voided all transactions, Tennistrader would not have lost anything if he is the same person behind both accounts, the one who layed Lena Lutzeier the one who layed Han N.

If Betfair officially decided to void those 2 transactions, what bet-ibc should do? They are intermediaries. Personally don't believe any agent would cover those 64k out of their own pocket if betfair decided to void both related transactions. However, i am expecting a proof from Bet-IBC that betfair indeed voided those transactions. They already stated that Betfair response is confidential, however, if Tennistrader approves they must give us more details imo.

Personally need to know more regarding the points below:
1) Tennistrader  said that profit came from a liquid market but market wasn't liquid according to Bet-IBC. Not familiar with Tennis so need Tennis experts to en-light us here.
2) Tennistrader  said that he wouldn't have problems if game was voided and was given back his deposits. I personally don't understand why he would agreed to that solution.
3) Can't understand why Tennistrader waited 8 months to complain.

Will wait Tennistrader response. If game was a non liquid market, i would personally vote for Bet-IBC even though we would never be 100% sure unless ip's addresses involved were the same.
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vinciguerra
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vinciguerra

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #17 on: December 23, 2018, 06:00:20 PM »

lutzeier is a nobody, plays two itf-quallies a year, isn't even top-1000.  han is pretty decent player, 200-400 of the world for years. i don't need to see an odds archive to know han would have been 1.10-ish or (much) less before the match.

the OP apparently managed to lay lutzeier at 1.06.  those are insane odds, and at no point before the match or during the match (which ended 0-6 4-6) were these odds correct.

there are 2 possibilities.

either:  1. another trader made a mistake. and the op profited. betfair saved the trader's ass for some reason by voiding.
or: 2. the op was transfering money to himself in an illiquid market.

if "tennistrader" sticks to his statement that the odds were somehow "normal" (because of an injury time out), he must think he is the only tennis trader in the world and we are all idiots on this forum, it's an insult to my IQ, and in that case I tend to believe scenario 2.  if "tennistrader" would admit he tried to take advantage or someone else's mistake, it's a bit more credible. there have been incidents on "wrong" odds being voided on exchanges without just cause (perhaps because those traders making the mistakes were working for the exchange), so who knows. but as it stands now, i tend so side with betfair.
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dealer wins
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Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #18 on: December 23, 2018, 11:15:32 PM »

Betfair have no in house traders or market makers, it could have been a very vip client, but even then I doubt Befair would void a trade as its totally against their rules.  Sounds to me more likely to be a transfer attempt, and if it was then the OP will be screwed as Betfair will not return the funds I think.
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arbusers
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Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #19 on: December 23, 2018, 11:31:07 PM »

Betfair have no in house traders or market makers

Are you sure about that?
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dealer wins
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Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #20 on: December 24, 2018, 08:57:57 AM »

A couple of years ago I attended one of their VIP outings (to see strictly come dancing at London O2) and had a good chat with with the VIP guy.  He said they never trade their own markets, have no traders etc 

Maybe he was being untruthful though lol
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apoel81
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apoel81

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #21 on: December 24, 2018, 09:07:50 AM »

Betfair have no in house traders or market makers

Are you sure about that?

If not mistaken, few years ago betfair was accused for added liquidity on markets from their traders . They get penalised and are now prohibited to allow bettors bet against them.
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DPG
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Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #22 on: December 24, 2018, 09:20:39 AM »


Well over 80% of the money you see on betunfair exchange is from their own in house bots.
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pythonic
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pythonic

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #23 on: December 24, 2018, 01:14:00 PM »

Quote
Well over 80% of the money you see on betunfair exchange is from their own in house bots.
Thats just not true. I have never seen any proof for these accusations that betfair trades their own markets.
Maybe they did some low level seeding some years ago. But unlike smarkets, it's not part of their business model to trade their own markets.
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DPG
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Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #24 on: December 24, 2018, 01:51:23 PM »

They do seed all their own Exchange under the guise of a 3rd party. I remember reading it was a Scandanavian company. Think the name of it was Betting Promotions.   


Edit: Just found this post on betunfair forum;

"Betting Promotion signs agreement with Betfair
Betting Promotion has signed an agreement with Betfair to provide liquidity on a large
number of markets. This agreement supersedes all previous agreements.
Betfair is the world’s leading betting exchange with more than one million registered
customers and over five million transactions per day.
“We are glad to continue our close cooperation with Betfair. This agreement also confirms
Betting Promotion’s status as the leading market maker for betting exchanges” commented
CEO of Betting Promotion, Johan Moazed.
Malmö May 20 2008
For further information, please contact:
Johan Moazed, CEO Betting Promotion Sweden AB."
« Last Edit: December 24, 2018, 02:02:41 PM by DPG » Logged
pythonic
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pythonic

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #25 on: December 24, 2018, 02:44:14 PM »

IMO this company seems to be just a large market maker and the agreement would probably involve a guarantee from that company to provide some minimum basic liquidity for a range of markets. It's also ten years old. Of course there are external market makers operating at betfair, that's just how this platform works. But I don't see any evidence that they are controlled by betfair.
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arbusers
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arbusers

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #26 on: December 24, 2018, 08:04:37 PM »

Let's not get too far with the ''Betfair trading itself'' and focus on the incident.
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Tennistrader
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Tennistrader

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #27 on: December 25, 2018, 04:42:05 AM »

Hey guys,

Merry Christmas.

@Arbusers I agree. Please guys, just standby until my next post exposing this bet-ibc scammer, I'm just finishing my research.

Grab the popcorn because you're going to love it, I promise.

However, if you are one of the first to read this, I advise you to request a withdraw right now because I'm sure that they will have a lot of work soon.



Let me quote here because I bet it will delete.
Dear Arbusers Forum Community!

One of our top clients since many years and also a very happy member of this forum, informed us about that thread, so we wanted to leave a reply in order to provide the forum community with the truth.

The complainer „Tennistrader“ did the following bets on the match Han N. - Lutzeier L. (Challenger Women Honolulu):

Lay Lena Lutzeier 33 283 EUR @ 1,06 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:11
Lay Lena Lutzeier 28 528 EUR @ 1,07 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:18
Lay Lena Lutzeier 28 528 EUR @ 1,07 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:30
Lay Lena Lutzeier 3 199 EUR @ 1,07 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:51

The game ended 6/0, 6/4 for Han N., so at no point that odd was correct.
Afterwards the complaining person „Tennistrader“ did some bets on the other side to take all risk out and make a sure profit (transfer money from one account to the other):
Eg.:
Lay Han N. @ 1,16 on 19/11/2017 at 21:49:18
Lay Han N. @ 1,18 on 19/11/2017 at 21:49:40
Lay Han N. @ 1,19 on 19/11/2017 at 21:49:45

Everyone who knows odds, understands that within 9 minutes, the odds cannot move from 1,06 on Lutzeier to 1,16 on Han N., having the 1st set 6:0 for Han N.
So what happened here is the complainer „Tennistrader“ transfered money between one or more accounts, offering very low odds in a very small market where nobody else at that time was betting.
People which use stolen credit cards make that since years and it is a very well know tactic among thieves.

What is only surprising for us, BET-IBC, is that someone like the complainer „Tennistrader“, who obviously has so much experience in this „business“, seriously expected that Betfair won´t find out such scam.

After being detected by Betfair, the money was refunded by Betfair to the account holder where the money should have been transfered from. So no damage for the complainer „Tennistrader“ occured.

Since the complainer „Tennistrader“ filed multiple complains without any positive outcome for him at various places like the licence authority in Montenegro, sportsbookreview.com, etc., it seems that Betfair did everything like it should have been done.

That topic was and is closed for us and we won´t comment any further.

Kind Regards,
BET-IBC
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Tennistrader
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Tennistrader

Re: Betfair / bet-ibc moved 64K from my acc
« Reply #28 on: December 28, 2018, 09:50:36 AM »

Dear community,


When I finished reading the bet-ibc post I didn't want to believe what I was reading, I was shocked! I was their client for 3 years, I was always correct and honest with them, they received from me thousands of euros in fees, and the best way they use it to treat their customers is to come out to the public by calling them a scammer and thief!

Take note that it is from the very first day that bet-ibc knows that I have the proofs and yet their behavior is as you can see.

It's very easy to accuse anyone, the hardest thing is to prove it.

Well, let’s do it, shall we...


The complainer „Tennistrader“ did the following bets on the match Han N. - Lutzeier L. (Challenger Women Honolulu):

Lay Lena Lutzeier 33 283 EUR @ 1,06 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:11
Lay Lena Lutzeier 28 528 EUR @ 1,07 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:18
Lay Lena Lutzeier 28 528 EUR @ 1,07 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:30
Lay Lena Lutzeier 3 199 EUR @ 1,07 on 19/11/2017 at 21:40:51

The game ended 6/0, 6/4 for Han N., so at no point that odd was correct.
Afterwards the complaining person „Tennistrader“ did some bets on the other side to take all risk out and make a sure profit (transfer money from one account to the other):
Eg.:
Lay Han N. @ 1,16 on 19/11/2017 at 21:49:18
Lay Han N. @ 1,18 on 19/11/2017 at 21:49:40
Lay Han N. @ 1,19 on 19/11/2017 at 21:49:45

Everyone who knows odds, understands that within 9 minutes, the odds cannot move from 1,06 on Lutzeier to 1,16 on Han N., having the 1st set 6:0 for Han N.


Are you serious?! Oh come on, what a stupid move, this is all you got?

You are here scamming and manipulating the users opinion against me, this practice done by a company is considered a crime, did you know that?

Guys, let’s do this exercise together, shall we?

This is the “what is missing” test.

Check again my bets posted by bet-ibc, did you found what’s missing? No? See again please... not yet? Ok, I can tell you, it’s my stakes @1.16 1.18 and 1.19!!!

My stakes at this odds was:

Lay Han 256 EUR @ 1,16
Lay Han 67 EUR @ 1,18
Lay Han 14 EUR @ 1,19

So, for bet-ibc, taking risk out and make a sure profit trade is lay one player with 93k and lay the other one with 337!
This bet-ibc guy is the best trader in the world!
What a fail, ridiculous!

I will try my best to explain my trades at this "shitty game".

I also want to make a repair, and admit my mistake, I wrote above that the odds were way off due to players injury, but only when I went to study my back/lay trades at this game, I remembered that it wasn’t the case.

The “shitty game” went live... and suddenly I saw a big stake matching all that were in Lena's lay until 1.05, my first reaction was WOW someone(or bot) just did a big mistake, and I saw that they were still about 100k stakes laying Lena between 1.01-1.05, what is the instant move of any trader in a situation like this? Lay Lena at 1.06, right? And I got matched... and again at 1.07!

Next, I checked how the market would react, and since I wasn’t the only one who got matched, the odds were not adjusting – Liquid market.

As you can see(P.1), my first entry is laying Han only after 3m(23:43) with 1,563 @1.82

At page 2 you can see the odds slowly adjusting, and I keep laying to hedge.

As the 1st set was running fast, 6-0 in 20m, you can see at page 3 my most aggressive moves, for those who don't know, Betfair only voids all the market if the 1st set is not finished.

I've been caught several times in fixed and shitty games like this one, so if Han quits, at least I was with a profit from Lena’s victory.

Game page 1: Screenshot deleted by arbusers.com for data protection.
Game page 2: Screenshot deleted by arbusers.com for data protection.
Game page 3: Screenshot deleted by arbusers.com for data protection.

So guys, this makes sense to you?

Or looks like someone transferring money between accounts like bet-ibc is accusing me?

My Skrill movements looks like someone with several accounts? Or only one without any movement while it was suspended?

Skrill: Screenshot deleted by arbusers.com for data protection.


But I found that someone needs several websites to scam: http://bet.dotfusion.ro

So what happened here is the complainer „Tennistrader“ transfered money between one or more accounts, offering very low odds in a very small market where nobody else at that time was betting.


Looks like what happened here is btc-ibc transferred the 64k eur to one of his sub-accounts and put it in their pockets.

People which use stolen credit cards make that since years and it is a very well know tactic among thieves.


So, what’s you're saying here is that is very easy to open a Betfair account, get verified through their KYC/AML and deposit 100k eur with a stolen card ?!!!

Everyone here knows that’s illusion, but let’s check if this is even possible...

The money was transferred to an Hong Kong account, let’s connect to HK using vpn and try to open a new account...
Error: "You are not permitted to register with Betfair from the country you are in."

Let’s check if Betfair accepts Visa/MasterCard from Hong Kong: https://support.betfair.com/app/answers/detail/a_id/53/c/424

What is only surprising for us, BET-IBC, is that someone like the complainer „Tennistrader“, who obviously has so much experience in this „business“, seriously expected that Betfair won´t find out such scam.


It’s also surprising for me, that someone like you with so much experience in this gambling industry has a website running since 2007 with missing pages like this one: “Guaranteed security of your personal information”

I'm sure it’s guaranteed! Because you don’t do the KYC/AML to anyone, does E-Gambling Montenegro and your partners knows that you don’t comply? If not, I'm sure they will.

When I opened my account, they didn’t any KYC, and it seems that they remain the same.
Yesterday at their chat: https://ibb.co/dtf6P5D

It's pretty clear here who the scammer is.

After being detected by Betfair, the money was refunded by Betfair to the account holder where the money should have been transfered from. So no damage for the complainer „Tennistrader“ occured.


The investigation concluded that everything was correct with my account, otherwise Betfair wouldn’t be unsuspended with 23k eur balance.

I won about 80k eur in this two "shitty games", you're saying Betfair refunded 64k eur(my withdraw), who payed the remaining 16k eur?

If you don't know, Betfair have software to detect trading patterns, they know perfectly well that I'm a legit trader.

But you’re right, the money was refunded to the account holder: To my account! Then maybe bet-ibc took advantage of the situation, since I wasn't sure about the investigation, and then transferred to himself to another sub-account.

Why Betfair reversed the withdraw from your master-account to mine and not directly to another?

Since the complainer „Tennistrader“ filed multiple complains without any positive outcome for him at various places like the licence authority in Montenegro, sportsbookreview.com, etc., it seems that Betfair did everything like it should have been done.


Are you sure about this? If I were you I wouldn't sing victory before the time, you know why? The complaints were only sent last week, get ready for the knock knock on your door.

That topic was and is closed for us and we won´t comment any further.


If it was closed, you wouldn't be here every 2 hours! Is fear of being exposed? opsss

You should realize that I'm not a retard like you, and this case is only closed when I get my money back or you in jail.

I hope your next comment is a huge apology, to me and to everyone here, and the funds has been returned to me.



Happy Holidays  8)
« Last Edit: January 05, 2019, 07:35:07 PM by Arbusers » Logged
vinciguerra
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Re: BET-IBC SCAM EXPOSED - With proofs
« Reply #29 on: December 28, 2018, 10:33:07 AM »

ok, this clears things up. tennistrader caught a bot gone rogue. still annoying tennistrader didn't immediately say this; now looking back he suddently remembered..  yeah right. but anyway, bet-ibc has some explaining to do.

if bet-ibc maintains he was transfering money, they need to provide proof. tennistrader has, and i don't believe betibc's accusation.

tennistrader's claim that betibc took the money is not really proven wel either. but why was the money transfered out, and not just voided and refunded like betfair normally does, very shady.

even if betibc didn't took the money: why aren't they siding with the player here. it betfair did void, that's a problem:  faulty bot or no faulty bot, it's an exchange not a bookmaker; they have no right to void.

regardless, betibc has some serious explaining to do.
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